Second of all, my views on addressing wedding invitations have nothing at all to do with my being (or not being) Indie, they have to do with me being feminist, and being raised by a feminist. I don’t find refusing to be addressed by my husband’s given name as ‘indie,’ for me it’s part of my fundamental belief system. In the end, I think people tend to use labels like Indie in a way that makes it seem like it’s a club that you are in or out of, and that is unfair to everyone concerned – unfair to you, unfair to me. Am I Indie? Maybe. It depends what standards you are using, or which of my choices you are considering. Am I a feminist? Yes, always. But your choices, feminist or no, do not need to reflect my choices. We’re also clearly coming from different social worlds. The idea that everyone is not very aware of the Mrs. John Blow issue is mind boggling to me, and clearly it’s something that you didn’t think was a major issue.

Finally, just so you know, I actually went back and re-read quite a bit of Miss Manners revised edition of “Guide to Excruciatingly Correct Behavior” last night, before I responded. She has a fascinating section in the beginning on allowing people to style their names as they wish. In addition, if you look at p. 308, you’ll see the bit where she discusses this very issue, and the fact that it is quite heated on both sides. She suggests that we address people as they wish to be addressed in this “age of choice” and that we try not to get too upset when people address us otherwise. I (like many) am less good at the second part of her entreaty, but we all have our failings. Finally, as always with a complex writer with Miss Manners, I think it’s important to think about her writings in their entirety when coming to conclusions, rather then site her chapter and verse. Her whole thesis is that etiquette is about respect, and that etiquette is constantly changing to reflect the social mores of the time. When you take these two things together, you’ll understand why it is absolutely proper etiquette to acknowledge that modes of formal address are changing (or in some circles changed years ago).

Meg

When it comes to addressing wedding invitations, Miss Manners is my only source. It’s misrepresenting her to say she says people should be addressed the way they want to be addressed.

She was referring to couples with different names. But Miss Manners is still saying that the proper address on a FORMAL wedding invitation is Mr. and Mrs. John Blow.

Mr. and Mrs. Blow is considered informal.

Also, Mrs. Sassy Blow is reserved for a divorced woman who kept her married name. Miss Manners and others say that it is never proper for a married women to be Mrs. Sassy Blow.

I would not say that society has discussed this issue in the same way as “Ms” was discussed. The whole “Ms” thing was discussed in major newspapers and magazines for years before it was adopted.

The discussion of how to address married couples with the same last name has not yet reached that wide an audience.

Considering all this, at this time I would go the traditional route if I were having a formal wedding. I would be more comfortable with Mr. and Mrs. Blow if the wedding were very informal.

I find it incredibly sad that some people would latch onto this as something to get angry about, when nothing new has yet been agreed on in our society.

I’ve always thought of myself as fairly “indie”, but I see that I don’t quite fit in here.

I read your original post a while ago and I can’t remember if you addressed this. I want to avoid “and guesting” people who obviously deserve to be addressed.

Society has made this a point of discussion: I’ve been very aware of it for my whole life. That said, for anyone who was not aware it was a general point of discussion, consider yourself warned, in the nicest possible way. The standard has changed already in many social circles. If it hasn’t changed yet for you, please be aware that it has changed for others, and will continue to change.

And, “In the meantime, I would hope that any married couple who shared the same last name wouldn’t be offended just because I addressed their invitation in the standard way!”

Perhaps if we all had our very best natures, we would manage to not be offended. That said, names are very personal, and since this is no longer standard for many of us, it’s good to be aware that you will in fact offend some people very deeply if you use this form of address. Now you know.

I did read your original post.

But I was responding to your later comment that you didn’t think Mr. and Mrs. John Blow was the default standard anymore.

I merely pointed out that except for couples with separate names, or a woman with a hyphenated name, it is still considered the default standard – not because it’s fancy, but because it’s, well, standard.

(Even Miss Manners says so.)

Now if society decided to make it a point of discussion as they did with the invention of the title “Ms.”, and agreed to change to something else, then the standard would change.

In the meantime, I would hope that any married couple who shared the same last name wouldn’t be offended just because I addressed their invitation in the standard way!

Finally, please don’t say “even” Miss Manners says Ms. is ok. Of course Miss Manners says Ms. is ok. Miss Manners is one of the wisest, wittiest, and most practical writers around. It’s also Miss Manners who points out that etiquette is about respect. The bottom line is: you need to address people as they wish to be addressed (that includes addressing older women as Mrs. John Blow, as covered in my first post) and addressing people by the names that they use socially. Period.

Finally, please read my first post. I discussed, at some length, the fact that couples with different last names traditionally have their names written on different lines. I suspect that I’m more familiar and respectful of etiquette then you imagine.

Meg

In talking about Miss Manners, I should have mentioned that I’m a totally different “Anonymous” than the first one.